The 12th of April is celebrated in Russia as the day of cosmonautics. In that day in far 1961 Joury (Youry?) Gagarin became the very first human being that entered the outer space. And his name will remain in history forever.
Happy Cosmonautics day. :bg
Quote from: asmfan on April 12, 2006, 03:18:59 PM
Gagarin became the very first human being that entered the outer space.
Outer space? I don't know if anyone has been to outer-space yet. Inner-space, sure. :toothy
It still amazes me how resourceful humans were 45 years ago. The technology was so basic then! I guess there is something to be said for simplicity.
One day, the people of Earth might put a colony on the moon. Or on Mars, or Titan. That will be something. :thumbu
I don't know if it was just coincidence or not? But also:
12 April 1981--20 years later--first flight of the Space Shuttle Columbia.
Truly a big day in space flight first steps! :U
farrier
Speaking of space shuttles, AsmFan whatever did happen to the Soviet version of the shuttle program. IF I recall correctly, I've only seen one publically announced flight. Was their program cancelled after one flight ? If so, was any reason given for doing so?
Regards,
Rags
Rags,
the russian analog of reusable spacecraft (shuttle) was Buran (Blizzard or Snowstorm). It had been once (?) in space and then there was decided to stop its flights due to some problems. May be it was to expensive to repair it after landing, or/and smth else? I'm not informed well on this why it is so... But since that time they launch disposable rockets...
I congratulate all world with this day (day of Cosmonautics).
Поздравляю весь мир с днем космонавтики!!!
"Поздравляю весь мир с днем космонавтики!!!"
I remember well Gagarin and later Valentina Tereshkova
but I'm wondering why you are so proud...
From history we know:
Bad people create and use new technology just to kill
other people, to make more money and power.
They need other's people money about that and start to
propagandize some "scientific” theory (as religion)
just to wash your mind out
With other words the most of the people (taxpayers) just pay with
their money for nothing
If you disagree with me just tell me what you, your family and your friends
(from Russia or USA) won from "The Cosmonautics"
Regards,
I still remember one poem that i had learn in school when i was a little boy:
Юрий Гагарин, как си летял?
Бързо ли хвърка корабът бял?
Там сред звездите пръв щом си бил
Дунав видя ли, зърна ли Нил?
Зьрна ли нейде сред синева
друг по обичан град от Москва?
Дето децата в лятната шир тичат
на воля, пеят за мир.
Юрий Гагарин славен пилот
ти прьв преброди звездният свод. :lol
:clap:
Quote from: asmfan on April 12, 2006, 03:18:59 PM
The 12th of April is celebrated in Russia as the day of cosmonautics. In that day in far 1961 Joury (Youry?) Gagarin became the very first human being that entered the outer space. And his name will remain in history forever.
Did Russia send up animals first or directly with humans ?
lingo,
There is so many things in your life that you and I use every day that came from the space
programs. from medications, to cell phones and GPS, to even the internet being able to chat
with people all over the world.
Nice pay off if you ask me.
Zcoder....
Quote
If you disagree with me just tell what you, your family and your friends
(from Russia or USA) win from "The Cosmonautics"
I think, among all Russian people I know, I can NOT find one who'd say a bad word about USSR "The Cosmonautics".
Most people here still think that it was the best thing that happened in USSR.
What we got? In old times we got hope, dreams,pride, insurance of military defence, and perspective.
And for us in old times it worth more than money.
For western people strange thing about USSR was that highly educated people got less money that simple workers.
Yet people would go to Universities (it was free education) 'cause it meant to have
interesting job, though the job was less paid. "Cosmos" demands so much development in all hightechs that nothing else could involve. In all fields of sience.
For example why "Proton" is still most reliable space missile? It's first of all heat stable mettal, and only then engine,electonics (also heat stable) and architecture. So Cosmos it is a lot of math, chemestry, phisics, electronics and so on...
It was interesting jobs and very interesting, perspective project. Millions very interesting jobs. And expansion to outer space - not to other human beings countries.
What do you prefer instead - new car?, blonds from PlayBoy?, fat belly? it's boring, man... I fill sorry for people with such a limmited "dreams"...
In USSR is lived (60s,70s,80s) ideology for ordinary people was idealistic, not realistic, but I missed it sometimes :)
It was propoganda of not agressive existence (doctors, resque groups etc., comsmonauts thought to be more prestiges and "heroic" proffessions than solders), solders thought to be "good" only if they defence their country (not "free" others countries) , intelectual superority worthed more than ability to kill, spiritual values worth more that money, intersting job worth more than highly paid etc.
So for children the best role to play "hero", was to play "cosmonauts".
And most important thing for old times was - while our leaders were arguing - our guys in Space station "Souz-Appolo" got on very well.
In general soviet people wanted to have the Americans as freinds rather than enemies (I saw hundreds of Holliwood movies where the American Heroes killed the Russians, and don't remember at least one soviet movie where the Soviet hero killed the Americans - even in stupid "spy - movies", spies were captured, not killed, from which I can assume that one side ideology was Good Russian is Dead Russian,
other side - Keep the American alive but talk him(her) into membership in Communist Party :) )
But there was thing that conrudict human nature - as the Americans the Soviets lived under thread of nulear war. Propoganda on both sides went on nuclear threat from other side. I can speak for myself, let our freinds from the US say for themselves if they lived in those times and remember all those educational movies for civilians "How to behave under nuclear attack", I personally thought that the life was loosing its sence - since the nuclear catastrophy seemed to be unavoidable. So on one hand you are always alerted by thread from other country, on other hand - you are told that the American people are generally good, hard workers, good researchers, sientists, peoneers etc. and you shouldn't start war with them. Everything in your head becomes mixed up, you don't know what to do, feeling that nothing depences on your opinion and actions, eventually preparing yourself to die.
So when our guys together went to space and did a great job there, and returned as freinds - it was great hope that might be not all was lost yet.
It's about old times. Talking of now days - "usage of Cosmos" (outer space) is a strange question indeed - it's now highly commercial and practical now. It's - cheap communications, sattelite Internet and TV, waether prediction, rescue operations. In future lots of perspective for ecology for example all this radiative garbage can be berried on some deserted planets instead of Earth. etc. etc.
Besides - the main thing is exploration of the Universe :)
Quote
Did Russia send up animals first or directly with humans ?
Animals. She-dog.
Quote from: skywalker on April 12, 2006, 11:36:56 PM
Quote from: asmfan on April 12, 2006, 03:18:59 PM
The 12th of April is celebrated in Russia as the day of cosmonautics. In that day in far 1961 Joury (Youry?) Gagarin became the very first human being that entered the outer space. And his name will remain in history forever.
Did Russia send up animals first or directly with humans ?
They sent a dog I believe though it was far before my time. I agree with The Svin, the Soviet space program was top notch and was riddled with all of the truly important firsts, there is no doubt that the US won the space race but that's only because the Soviet Union paved the road for them. However, it cannot be said that the US or Soviet Union were great innovators, most of the technology came for both sides from captured German scientists such as Herman Grottrup in the Soviet Union and Wernher Von Braun in the US, as well at the end of the war both countries seized a number of V2 rockets that became the nucleus of their space programs. Without the contribution of the Germans, both countries would probably still be trying to put something into orbit.
Donkey
I am old enough to remember Yuri Gagarin and it was as important as Sputnik a few years earlier, both being important firsts in space and an indication of who had superior technology first. While the US effort to put a man on the moon was a major technical step forward complete with the Saturn rocket technology to do it, one needs to have some idea of just how big the rockets at Balkonir actually are and they are still the only reliable way to service a space station as the Shuttle series have been plagued with reliability and safety problems.
Without remembering the order, I know it was Russia that first orbited the moon and sent back photos of the back of the moon, the US did the Mariner probe to Mars which sent back 360 degree scans of the surface but the one that did fascinate me was the Russian probe soft landing on Venus and sent back photos of the surface noting that the surface temperature is about that of molten lead.
Probably the factor against this type of technology is the sheer cost of doing it and the lack of viable low cost alternatives. Sooner or later a different propulsion system will need to be developed that is smaller and more powerful than various combinations of fossil fuel and oxygen and this probably means nuclear powering of some sort.
Hi Svin, :lol
“I think, among all Russian people I know, I can NOT find one who'd say a bad word about USSR "The Cosmonautics".
Most people here still think that it was the best thing that happened in USSR.”
“What we got? In old times we got hope, dreams, pride, insurance of military defence, and perspective. And for us in old times it worth more than money.”
I know it very well and it is a proof that the "scientific” theory of socialism works well
for brain washing, now in China for example…
“For western people strange thing about USSR was that highly educated people got less money that simple workers.”
Here in Toronto most of the cab drivers are “highly educated people” too…
so it is “normal” for “western people”…
"Yet people would go to Universities (it was free education) 'cause it meant to have interesting job, though the job was less paid."
Here is similar (not free education) and some young people still believe in “interesting job” but real live is not so easy and a it is bit different…
"Cosmos" demands so much development in all hightechs that nothing else could involve. In all fields of sience.
For example why "Proton" is still most reliable space missile? It's first of all heat stable mettal, and only then engine,electonics (also heat stable) and architecture. So Cosmos it is a lot of math, chemestry, phisics, electronics and so on...
It was interesting jobs and very interesting, perspective project. Millions very interesting jobs. And expansion to outer space - not to other human beings countries.
Of course you are very emotional, but the real goal and efforts was the creation of the reliable carriers of the nuclear weapons and it not so “interesting job” because some people still remember Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Chernobyl…
On the other hand you can’t work your “interesting job” in former communist country without permission of the “gorodskoi komitet KPSSa”. Well if you are a general member of the KPSS you still have a chance to work your “interesting job” but if someone from “gorodskoi komitet KPSSa” decides something else about your future, and the communist party “send you” to work somewhere… You are not free to say NO, aren’t you ?
“…from which I can assume that one side ideology was Good Russian is Dead Russian,”
What about “no man, no problem“ by Josef Stalin
“What do you prefer instead - new car?, blonds from PlayBoy?, fat belly? it's boring, man... I fill sorry for people with such a limmited "dreams"...
I fill sorry for you because:
- are you so experienced enough to evaluate properly the culture of the people against you?
- your list of “limited dreams” is very short and STUPID
Why?
-New car and/or boat – it is not a problem or “dream” here
- blonds from PlayBoy – I hate chemicals and silicones and prefer blond Russian and Polish girls
from my living area (not married)
- fat belly – may be it is your dream not mine because I am not a musician and visit a gym regularly
“In general soviet people wanted to have the Americans as freinds rather than enemies
It is a myth of the Soviet propaganda. In the real live Soviet people hate the Americans
because they are “guilty” for their poverty
“So for children the best role to play "hero", was to play "cosmonauts".
Against brain washing propaganda about real live and problems of these people
For example who knows details about the healthy status of the “cosmonauts" after the
landing, etc..
Talking of now days - "usage of Cosmos" (outer space) is a strange question indeed - it's now highly commercial and practical now. It's - cheap communications, sattelite Internet and TV, waether prediction, rescue operations.
Ok, but some years ago it was military top secret…and it is just a proof that
“the bad people create and use new high technology just to kill
other people, to make more money and power.”
“In future lots of perspective for ecology for example all this radiative garbage can be berried on some deserted planets instead of Earth. etc. etc.”
Fortunately it is very expensive and “all this radioactive garbage” will stay in Russia
and other nuclear countries. There is enough Russian and USA garbage in the space…
skywalker,
"Did Russia send up animals first or directly with humans ?"
Link about Russian space dogs:
http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Russian+space+dogs
Regards,
Lingo
Quote
“For western people strange thing about USSR was that highly educated people got less money that simple workers.”
Here in Toronto most of the cab drivers are “highly educated people” too…
so it is “normal” for “western people”…
You didn't get my point.
First of all let's make it clear - I told about USSR time, not present Russia.
And the fact that even after detailed explonation you understood me in a wrong way just proves that I was right about it was strange.
I told not about education of "drivers", but about jobs that aimed for educated people in USSR were paid less than dirty work aimed for unqualified workes.
Is usual there where you are in Toronto, is it usual that unqualified workers are paid more than highly qualified engeneers and sientists with wolrd known names?
My point was that In USSR it was usual that bus driver earned more money than professor, yet people go to Universities 'cause it meant more intersting job though the job was usualy harder and paid less.
Do I make myself clear, or you are going to insist that in your Toronto uneducated shit-cleaners make more money than proffessors?
Quote
I know it very well and it is a proof that the "scientific” theory of socialism works well
for brain washing, now in China for example…
Wake up, lingo. There are no more USSR, KPSS etc, I told of opinon of Russians I know that live now in absolutly different country :)
I always been interested in exploring outerspace and was sad spacerace stopped, oilcrisis and Americans think they won
that all talk Bush said about moonbase and mars is good, but its not because he is a visionary like Kennedy, but out of nessesity, because he is afraid the chineses will be catching up and win spacerace now
much useful inventions in international space station, comes from russian experience of spending longtime in space, developed chemicals to make air reusable, while the crappy spaceshuttle is limited to 14 days of airsupply
those pioneers are not so celebrated as first in space, first on moon, but they make great job, trying to know how it works when humans spend longtime in space, which is required for trips beyond moon
I feel sorry for Gagarin died in an accident later when he was flight instructor
Svin
well uneducated shitcleaners vs proffessors generalism, we dont live in such World anymore, our local busdriver is welleducated doctor, but he cant get that job because he is black and he still needs to pay his bills he has to take such simple job
many are welleducated but has to take simple jobs here
Quote
It is a myth of the Soviet propaganda. In the real live Soviet people hate the Americans
because they are “guilty” for their poverty
Man, sorry but it sound stupid ;)
'Cause
1. there are no "Soviet people" anymore, so you can not use the verb "hate" in present time.
2. When I was "a soviet" - I didn't hate the Americans, my mother, sister, brothers etc. didn't.
Freinds, schoolmate ... etc people didn't also. I intentially stressed in my posts by "people I know",
"in my times" - that I'm talking of my own experience. What do YOU know about it? Tales?
If you don't belive I'm honest by some strange means in my words - then call me a lier. But, don't call me Soviet propoganda, 'cause you are talking to me (the Svin), not to some "Soviet propoganda".
3. We couldn't know if there were people "“guilty” for our poverty", 'cause we had in general no idea that we were "in poverty".
We lived in information blocade. And when you can't compare your life with others you don't know wether it's better or worse :).
There were some rumors about realities the West, but there were just a few who knew it for sure.
And rumors were about both better and worse realities.
On one side hand were rumors of better salaries, shops, services, on the other hand - rumors of unemploiments, high house rents, expencive food and education. So it had been very hard to know untill iron shield fell.
Soviet propoganda... funny :)
I even wasn't member of Komsomol, if you know what I'm talking about. In our city (1 000 000 population), there were just 2 guys who refused to be a Komsomol member, with all problems that followed... And I was one of them.
You know our talks remind me some UN discussions in time of Cold War.
Do we need to be so pathetic? Why can't we as normal people, not politicians, just share information as eye witnesses, how it is (was) in places where we live(d)?
Did I tell you how people live in Canada?
No - 'cause I don't live there. Why then I'm constanly told how people lived in the USSR or live in Russia by those who don't live in Russia?
Why need we agitate each other. I was first to call USSR "for simple people" ideology "idealistic and not realistic".
But about things I remember - I fermly stand my grounds - people were proud about Kosmos, violence was something shamefull,
and about what hate you are talking - I don't know - home libraries of usual people were full of books by the American writers, people loved jazz, and so on - I LIVED IN USSR - I SAW IT WITH MY OWN EYES, now - may be some large group don't like the Americans, but not in the USSR - it is myth that soviets hated the Americans, though they like more Native Americans than not native ones :)
Quote from: !Czealot on April 13, 2006, 07:55:13 AM
Svin
well uneducated shitcleaners vs proffessors generalism, we dont live in such World anymore, our local busdriver is welleducated doctor, but he cant get that job because he is black and he still needs to pay his bills he has to take such simple job
many are welleducated but has to take simple jobs here
Thanks, !Czealot.
Allow me clarify it to death :) With your help, if you don't mind.
Assume the local busdriver some day has found a job appropriate for him as welleducated doctor.
Will he be a better paid as a qualified doctor than he used to be paid as driver?
Quote
What about “no man, no problem“ by Josef Stalin
1. I didn't live in his time, and I was talking of time I've been living. So it not relative to the topic.
2. Stalin killed his own people, not the Americans. He hate his own people. But again it doesn't consern to Russians\Americans hate.
3. I talked not of leaders (to wich I don't belong) but of usual people. You force me type the same things, I've already typed, for many times. May be it doesn't worth be in such rush, and read words more caryfully, or you can be at risk to fight with some point that isn't actually present?
Quote
cant get that job because he is black
Hm...
Do you still have such a problem?
I thought it is history nowdays :\
Quote
On the other hand you can’t work your “interesting job” in former communist country without permission of the “gorodskoi komitet KPSSa”. Well if you are a general member of the KPSS you still have a chance to work your “interesting job” but if someone from “gorodskoi komitet KPSSa” decides something else about your future, and the communist party “send you” to work somewhere… You are not free to say NO, aren’t you ?
Yes, in general it's right. Though it has nothing to do with my point. You are trying to brake into opened door :)
My point is about different aspect.
Ok, let me put it in this way:
What usually means "promotion" for the western people?
Correct me if I'm wrong - usually it means changing both work conditions and salary.
And usually it means changing for better.
By work conditions you could mean many things, better tools, rooms, possibilities, controls etc.
Better salary - obvious - means more money.
Not aways in USSR :)
For example you start as worker with 430r. per month salary, you got more experienced, skillfull, resourcefull.
To say more - you become highly respected, and your soviet BOSS decided to promote you.
He offer you job as "the Master" - mean that you become a chiff of large group of workers,
you can control them, direct them, teach them, all of them under your athority.
And what about your salary? From 430 r. it falls to 150 r.... :)
It was the way the commy tried to regulate emploiment, qualified and prestiges jobs paid less them dirty, borring job.
As beginner actor I was paid 90 r. - taxis.
As musician - classic player less than 80 r.
As musician teacher for amatours - 190 r.
As musician teacher for proffies - 75 r :)
As director of student music theater 45 r !
But when I was a simple male nurse in mental hospital I had 750 r.
And I'm not saying that it was good system (I think it was not) - I'm just saying that despite this abnormal system people went to the Universities, there were lots of Universities yet they provide tens times less student places than people who want to get high graduation. There was government insured distribution of the graduated, so they got jobs for sure according to proffession they got
(in case of missunderstanding that they couldn't find job in their speciality - they got those jobs for sure) - the only problem was that work as scienist meant less money than work as unqualified worker.
Svin,
From my observations, it appears that the October Revolution changed nothing except the names of the ruling class, with the elimination of the Monarchy.
Using the information that was made available here in the West about the Soviet system, it seems to me that Lennin and Stalin set themselves up as czars, with the Party elite replacing the wealthy class of people.
The Communists Party upper level members were given better homes, cars, etc, while the average person got none of these.
As you said, I dont know for shure, because I didn't live there. I'm just using the information available to me.
I have no love for the czar and his Cossacks either. They murdered most of my Great-Grandmothers family, and burned their farm, she was Ukranian.
Rags
Alex,
Your list of occupations to payment is in fact very interesting in that it does remove the ilitist element from work that needs to be done on the basis of who gets paid for the dirtiest work or the hardest jobs. I have long had the image of someone who works in a sewerage treatment plant doing what is a really horrible job yet if it was not done, the society that uses the sewerage facility would be overflowing in its own effluent.
With a simple question, why should someone in a warm comfortable job get paid more than someone who does a hard dirty job, often out in the cold ?
Kennedy was not a visionary,
Back in Kennedy's time the Americans came up with a plot to defeat the USSR
by over spending them and couse the USSR to go bank rupt, some ways was
through out spending in SPACE, WEAPONS, ECT, ECT
So kennedy started it out by making that statement not knowing how long it would
take, but that it would make the USSR spend more to stay ahead.
Then in the late 80's Regan talked about the so called star war's which did not exist.
and the fact that the USSR was not doing good in Afganistan and the cost of that war
and the space programs and the keeping up of all this weapon sh*t took it's tole.
There is more detail I left out, as I was just touching on points of what the true reason for
Kennedy's speach was way back then.
Zcoder....
Quote from: donkey on April 13, 2006, 01:15:02 AM
Quote from: skywalker on April 12, 2006, 11:36:56 PM
Quote from: asmfan on April 12, 2006, 03:18:59 PM
The 12th of April is celebrated in Russia as the day of cosmonautics. In that day in far 1961 Joury (Youry?) Gagarin became the very first human being that entered the outer space. And his name will remain in history forever.
Did Russia send up animals first or directly with humans ?
They sent a dog I believe though it was far before my time. I agree with The Svin, the Soviet space program was top notch and was riddled with all of the truly important firsts, there is no doubt that the US won the space race but that's only because the Soviet Union paved the road for them. However, it cannot be said that the US or Soviet Union were great innovators, most of the technology came for both sides from captured German scientists such as Herman Grottrup in the Soviet Union and Wernher Von Braun in the US, as well at the end of the war both countries seized a number of V2 rockets that became the nucleus of their space programs. Without the contribution of the Germans, both countries would probably still be trying to put something into orbit.
Donkey
I agree with Donkey.
Also I remember that Soviet Union sent a female dog with name
Lika before Gagarin.
Manos.
I am not sure what the weight of animal testing is in terms of the space race but its well known that both the US and the old Soviet lost people in tragedies from equipment failure. Its like most leading edge or dangerous things, every so often someone doing something risky gets killed yet I suggest that people who do these things already know the risk.
Test pilots used to live dangerously with both civilian and military aircrafts and I remember seeing some spectacular air crashes from back in the 30s with racing aircrafts so its not like its anything new. Speed record attempts, mountain climbing, sky diving, motor racing and a host of other risky things all have a toll here and there.
Yeah I second that motion.
and I would like to add that programming is risky too, just last year I remember doing a
program that crashed so bad I lost the source to it as it did a bad number on the HD.
Zcoder....
Quote
In that day in far 1961 Joury (Youry?) Gagarin became the very first human being that entered the outer space. And his name will remain in history forever.
Now this guy had a set of stones on him.
Quote from: MaynardG_Krebs on April 14, 2006, 03:14:22 PM
Now this guy had a set of stones on him.
He shure as heck did. Too bad he had to die in a training flight. He was one brave person.
Anyone (whatever you call them in your native tounge), who straps themselves onto a controlled explosion, which is basically what a rocket engine is, does also.
Rags
Quote
He shure as heck did. Too bad he had to die in a training flight. He was one brave person.
Anyone (whatever you call them in your native tounge), who straps themselves onto a controlled explosion, which is basically what a rocket engine is, does also.
Rags
Most definitely anyone who would do this is very courageous, but Gagarin especially, not only for being the first human to do this but also doing this when the technology was in it's infancy with so many unkown variables and possibilities for things to go wrong.
It is always hard to be the very first, especially in a such risky hard job/adventure. Imagine you go there from where you may not come back, and nevertheless you proud of it, you not admit a slightest thought of fail because you do your best and even more to make the dream come true. Struggling with overweights, with pain caused by them, he'd done his mission. It is a deadly game indeed.
Quote
there is no doubt that the US won the space
:) I doubt it.
We just have different ways ;)
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/orl-asecdiscthomas27072705jul27,1,748691.column?ctrack=1&cset=true
Quote from: The Svin on May 05, 2006, 02:02:35 AM
Quote
there is no doubt that the US won the space
:) I doubt it.
Winning the "space race", or rather the "space armament race" would probably be seen as a futile and hopelessly destructive act by any passing-by aliens. We humans have this uncanny ability to only think inside our own little box. No wonder we haven't been contacted yet! :toothy
Right
I laugh at the idea of anyone having won the space race, we all know that Yuri Gagarin was the first in space, the US was first on the moon but that the USSR first orbitted the moon. The US were the first to put a lander on Mars, The USSR were the first to put a lander on Venus and it keeps going like this in both directions.
I think Mark has hit the nail on the head to our external observers :bg Wotta buncha nerds ! Wait til the winner of WW4 is decided (sticks and clubs) and then try again.
I hear that NASA is talking about the possibility of terra-forming Titan (http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.cfm), one of Jupiter's moons. It's very cold and not exactly hospitable, but they seem to think they can chemically break down the hydrocarbons in the surface to form large amounts of carbon dioxide, which over time will trap solar energy and warm the planet, in turn melting the water-ice and whatnot. They seem to think it's very much like a primordial Earth. Sounds pretty far-fetched... or maybe not. In any case, it's at least a seven-year journey using today's xenon-ion-drive propulsion technology. And that would probably be one-way.
Are we (humans) going to compete over who will get there first (and stockpile interplanetary nukes there) or will we unite our resources in peace and exploration to expand the presence of Human-kind?
“people create and use new high technology just to kill
other people, to make more money and power.”
Staff defy order over cancer scare
(http://www.theage.com.au/news/national/staff-defy-order-over-cancer-scare/2006/05/12/1146940723705.html)
Quote
Are we (humans) going to compete over who will get there first (and stockpile interplanetary nukes there) or will we unite our resources in peace and exploration to expand the presence of Human-kind?
You sound like a communist :)
Quote from: Mark Jones on May 11, 2006, 04:43:46 PM
In any case, it's at least a seven-year journey using today's xenon-ion-drive propulsion technology. And that would probably be one-way.
Now if we put all the bombs. . and maybe few politicians - just to see fair play. . oh and help with the hot air for warming. . .
You are sure it will take them seven years to get back?
Roger
This sounds like a good technique for propulsion, hard wire a collection of polititians to the arse end of a rocket and then start an argument and you would get enough hot air to reach light speed. :bg
In the United kingdom we have
Isaac Newton day where all UK citizens are supposed to get out there telescopes and watch the motion of the planets, while trying to catch apples falling from the sky.
James Clerk Maxwell day, when people can wonder about the connection between electricity and magnetism.
JJ Thomson day when all citizens watch television all day and wonder about the discovery of the electron.
John logie Baird day see television above, without the electron bit.
Turin day when we celebrate the death of our computer industry in 1945 when we handed over responsibility to the USA.
Pyramid day when we celebrate how the King of England gathered together 5000 men, who walked from Salisbury to Alexandria in Egypt and build the pyramids, then retuned home, without informing the indiginous population.
The guillottine, invented in 13th century England, but the magistrate stated once the blade was released, if you could get your head out of the way, you were free to go. This is where the English got there reputation of fair play.
Alexander Graham Bell day, when we spend all day on the telephone, trying to find out why he emigrated from Scotland to the United states, before inventing the telephone.
Industrial revolution day, say no more
Davy lamp day, Pity no one told the chinese about these 17th century safety lamps for miners.
Stevensons rocket day, when everyone goes on a train journey.
Stephen Perry day when everyone flicks rubber bands at each other.
Micheal Faraday day, when everyone pays homage to electrical appliances in there house, and celebrates the electric generator.
and im getting fed up know.
:U :U
zx81,
You've forgotten about "Day of flying saucers" :)
It must've been british pilot in New Mexico, who got under US "friendly fire" when they mixed up him with an alien :))
Just joking :) Here in Russia - British science and scientists are very respected. Both in historical and modern prospectives. The same respectfull fillings about education in the UK.
Steve
Quote
the US was first on the moon but that the USSR first orbitted the moon
We also sent the probe "LunaHod" (MoonWalker in English) on the Moon, before the US.
Funny thing - those "winners" still use our rocket engines in their rockets Atlas (the last american rocket to Pluton was sent with old russian engine aboard).
The engines were developed and produces in late 60s for soviet Moon programm, but they've never been used for the programm itself was suspended.
Our BS Pr. Eltzin was so eager to sell our national treasures for nothing that sold them to US for funny price - just 1 billion for 114 engines. They already spent them all :) - and asked us to produce more in 2005(4?). We talk about engines that were invented in 60s! and the US still wants it :)
Not mention that already for several years we've been forced to delever loads for both NASA and Russia to the international space station, and the US doesn't compensate a penny for our altruistic help, very strange approach for the country that called itself "world leader" and "space race winner" :)
I'm all to admit that in field of general electronics USA left Russia fa..ar behind. We had good fundmental researches in the field but should have thought better about production technologies, in the field the US won for sure. But in space exploration ... I doubt it, it just doesn't fit the facts. Yet it possible when old generation of numerous russian scientists emmigrate to the States, since new generation of russians moslty goes for economics, law etc. not for phisics and math. Though for contemplative russian mentality math and phisics/chemestry fit the best to national character, no matter how hard the west would try to sell us as "hairy barbarians" :)
Though I must admit - despite for mental national predisposition for science - it's very hard to be a scientist in Russia nowdays.
The most terrible thing that the commies did to their own nation was not poverty or repressions or like, it was supression of individual initiative, human will, even in cases that the will doesn't harm anibody, and doesn't ask for financial or other support. People (exept for small minority) just get used to do what they told to do, including scientists. I hope new generanions could overcome it, and will be able "to kill slaves inside our soul".
Alex,
There is a standard term for what you have described that has hit most of the western economies in exactly the same manner, it is sold as "economic rationalisation" which means useful technical people get shoved aside for the quick and dirty buck with no view to there being a future. It sees factories closed and massive numbers of people with no work so a few in the corporate sector can make big money importing similar goods from other countries that have a lower labour cost and a lower exchange rate.
The factor in common with all economies that allow this to happen is they get weaker and further into debt as they buy more than they can sell. Most of south America has escaped from this as they have shoved the IMF and its debt burden, CHina is not structured in this manner and of late an organisation called in English SCO has been set up based in Shanghai to co-ordinate economic interests across south Asia which includes technology and energy.
The four economic performers form an economic block called BRIC, Brasil, Russia, India and China and it is a sign of the future and countries that do not start to rebuild themselves risk being left behind if they don't.
The feat of putting a man in space and a man on the moon were fantastic achievments for Russia and the USA. The British contribution to anything space related was the invention of chocolate bars called,
The Mars Bar
A Galaxy bar
and believe it or not the Milky Way bar.
Oh and sum device that went to Mars on a European rocket. Sadly it forgot where the surface was.
"The great space race." That's such an oxymoron. The great race to what? The never-ending expanse of harsh vacuum and nothingness? Where it's +250 degrees in the sun and -250 degrees in the shade? Where there is no magnetosphere to protect you from radiation? Where the concept of seasonss or days or even minutes is completely irrelevant? Or where it takes 5 years to travel to the nearest planet (which is completely inhabitable?) No wonder it took a cold war to generate enough ambition to get to the moon. :lol
I don't want to think what it would take to move beyond that.
In the 1970's 1Meg of Ram was deemed unnessassary and unfillable (just like space). Then again C++ was'nt around then so they can be forgiven for there lack of hindsigh.
Hi All,
Quote from: zx81 on June 07, 2006, 02:22:33 AM
Then again C++ was'nt around then so they can be forgiven for there lack of hindsigh.
The trouble is that it is still around in the 2000s. No one should be forgiven for that much lack of foresight!
Regards Roger