MASM or TASM?

[TASMUser]

I prefer TASM for years because:
- I started ASM programming with it
- it generates more effective code with instructions like "add ebx,7" or "setflag dword ptr [var],880000h"
- it has support for OOP ("struct method")
- it doesn't know the pseudo instruction "invoke"
- it has a shorter commandline syntax
- it has some source code abbreviations which MASM doesn't know
- produces very sophisticated list files

Disadvantages:
- sometimes buggy
- to use macros with their full functionality the strange  IDEAL-mode must be activated
- creates OMF-object files only

---

To use local variables you can add the statement "locals".
By default all variables in procedures starting with "@@" will be declared as local.
"locals a" ensures that all variables starting with "a" will be declared as local.

[hutch--]

 :bg

Hi TASMUser,

Welcome on board. here are a few comparisons for you.

ML and LINK produce smaller exe files.

* - it doesn't know the pseudo instruction "invoke"

Yes but it does know an ambiguous usage of CALL to do much the same with PROCDESC prototypes.

MASM can handle much larger include files and has no problems with structures and unions.

MASM has a much more powerful macro system.

[dacid]

i started with tasm some years ago... but i quickly switch for masm...  tasm is no longer in development or supported and in a couple of years you will need to develop 64 bit applications.

[Rainstorm]

dacid wrote..

in a couple of years you will need to develop 64 bit applications..

A couple of years is a long time in computing time...and what if 128 bit or something starts looming on the horizon by then ? :lol
am thinking of maybe skipping the 64 bit phase (still learning 32 bit), anyhow masm doesn't support 64-bit. - if the 128-bit style is completely different again from the 64-bit, then maybe skipping 64 bit coding would be a good thing for me. - but if it retains aspects of the 64-bit style & picks up from there.. then, skipping 64bit wouldn't work out so good.

[dacid]

Its not the same... 64bits are REALLY needed at this time, they come to increasing, among other things, the maximum number of addressable memory from 4GB to 16EB (Exabytes, about 17 billion GBs). I think "16EB" will be enought for a while (a little more than 640k ;)

I really see the "really need" of 128 bits very far away while 64bits will become more and more comun/necessary.

Of course there is a version of MASM for 64bits ...

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/hb5z4sxd.aspx

And it can be obtained for free (please read and obey EULA) in the Windows Server 2003 DDK and the Windows Server 2003 R2 Platform SDK.

[Mark Jones]

That said, just a word that 64-bit... much like the transition from 16-bit to 32-bit, this "switch" is not a trivial change. Many things have changed, so it is more-or-less it's own animal.

As far as the popularity of 64-bit code and PC's, I would say that they are slow to enter the market and currently only fill a niche at best. (Don't misunderstand me, properly written 64-bit code is amazing to see, but any application is going to need a 32-bit version right now anyways, which kind-of defeats the purpose of writing in 64-bit assembler.) And 64-bit code has the nasty side-effect of requiring typically 4x the RAM to run in, simply because the extra DWORDS all over the place needed to represent all the pointers, data, registers etc. For instance, right after installation, WinXP typically uses about 175MB of ram, compared to XP64's 475MB. (That's just starting bare-bones windows -- no programs open at all.)

[Vortex]

Beside ml64.exe SolAsm,GoAsm and PoAsm are supporting 64-bit coding.

[jdoe]

As far as the popularity of 64-bit code and PC's, I would say that they are slow to enter the market and currently only fill a niche at best.

When Microsoft will do 64 bit only OS, it won't be slow anymore. And that time is coming... maybe after Windows 7.

:bdg

[PBrennick]

At this point and for some time to come there will be no '64bit only OS.' MS would be committing suicide to do anything like that. 32bit has many, many years left and no serious developer will overlook that fact. Why would they develop software that would lessen its market-ability. Dual-development increases costs that cannot be recovered so most developers will stick to 32bits for the time being. Keep in mind that there is still a very large market that still uses DOS driven software because of the security advantage. They did not even blink when windows 95/98 appeared on the horizon and they STILL have no desire to change.

-- Paul

[Mark Jones]

64-bit OS's should eventually be mainstream, I agree. Eventually. But unfortunately it might not be such a nice (and fast) transition as it was from 8-bit to 16-bit, then 16-bit to 32-bit -- 32-bit may be around for several decades or more, perhaps a century, requiring two versions of every program to be created for compatibility reasons during this time. If there was a 64-bit emulator for 32-bit kernels, then that would be perfect, since everyone could just switch to writing 64-bit code now. However this is not likely or impossible.

There are definite benefits to 64-bit addressing. It is also unfortunately, much more wasteful in terms of overhead.

[jdoe]

Paul,

Like it or not, that's what Microsoft is hoping. On Windows Server, it's closer than you think.
There is plenty of links like that.


http://windowsvistablog.com/blogs/windowsvista/archive/2007/05/18/on-64-bit-and-windows-client.aspx

http://blog.tmcnet.com/blog/tom-keating/microsoft/microsoft-ocs-2007-r2-next-release-to-be-64-bit-only.asp

http://www.techweb.com/wire/software/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=174400732

http://blogs.zdnet.com/Bott/?p=506

[dacid]

"Windows Server 2008 will be the last 32-bit operating system."

And as far as i know, microsoft plans include only two more 32bits "Client" releases: Windows 7 (2010) and other in 2014-2015 ... after that all Windows will be developed in 64bits versions only.

You know how the market is ... if i have 64bit version of my program and you dont  :tdown In computer world you need to be up to date or you will die quickly!  :boohoo:

Next Photoshop will get 64-bit boost--on Windows only
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13580_3-9909725-39.html

And so on...

[jj2007]

You know how the market is ... if i have 64bit version of my program and you dont  :tdown In computer world you need to be up to date or you will die quickly!  :boohoo:

Scary :8)
Just bought some furniture. The vendors were extremely confused, the management had just changed the software, a brand new accounting system. I saw the screen: plain DOS. So much to markets. Ever looked over the shoulder of your travel agent?

[japheth]

You know how the market is ... if i have 64bit version of my program and you dont  :tdown In computer world you need to be up to date or you will die quickly!  :boohoo:
And so on...

Absolutely true ... or, at least, that's what MS and Intel want you to believe. Since they invest so much money in their propaganda, there must be some victims at last ... congrats!