Big sh*t in the international stock market.

[hutch--]

Tracking the news today the international stock markets have taken a hammering, the large indexes in the US have dropped near 5%, Europe and Asia have taken a pounding and we have seen a drop of over 4% here in OZ and we don't have a debt problem.

The analysis I have seen is less than charitable about the Tea Party destabilising the US economy with its attempt to force the US into default and the stock market is showing it at the moment, Italy is on the brink of default and the rest of Europe seems to be in trouble as well trying to cover all of the shaky economies in Europe.

Sooner or later someone will have to do something about the global financial crisis and one of the good options is for every debt laden country to default as it would spread the financial load around to the extent that the losers would be the international banks, not individual economies. The end of the Euro would help many troubled European countries as it would allow different economies to handle their own income relative to their own production capacity. It may be time to bring back the Franc, Deutchmark and Drachma and work out some exchange rate betwen them rather than try and force all of these different economies to struggle along on the same currency.

[Bill Cravener]

Steve,

The tea baggers tail wags the GOP dogs. Even many on the right are now calling the tea baggers extremists after this debt fiasco. Americans now think the tea baggers have too much influence on the Republican Party. Eighty two percent of Americans now disapprove of the way Congress is handling its job, the lowest ever. More than four out of five people polled said that the recent debt ceiling debate was more about gaining political advantage than about doing what is best for the country. The polls also indicate that Republicans in Congress shoulder more of the blame for the difficulties in reaching a debt ceiling agreement than President Obama and the Democrats.

Budget cutting could not have occurred at a worse time, the federal government was the one segment of the economy that was helping to fill the gap left by the housing bust and the pullback in consumer spending. Stocks are falling like a rock rolling down a cliff yet most major companies have more than $2 trillion in cash on their balance sheets with corporate earnings up to record levels. But that does not help the unemployed when there is a dire need for nearly 14 million jobs to put them back to work. My opinion the Bush tax cuts must soon come to an end and our unfunded wars must be stopped now before it is to late for all of us! 

[Bill Cravener]

European assessments of the U.S. budget agreement

[hutch--]

Bill,

The funding limitations (the real ones, not the tea party) will eventually put and end to the two profit driven wars, Iraq is just about finished and Afghanistan is on the short list to exit. Combine the cost of those two wars which did nothing for US taxpayers except bleed them dry with the dirty deal the Federal Reserve did to fund the lossed at the end of 2007 and you know why the US is in trouble at the moment. Cut the war funding and start to tax the rich to pay their share and much of the trouble will be fixed but the real culprit is the Federal Reserve, a private consortium of bankers bleeding America dry and they will not stop until they have bled the last drop of blood out of US taxpayers.

[anunitu]

It is complacated in that the economy is a construct,not a natural interaction as it once was. A person is leashed to the many aspects of this system,you are in some ways controlled by how your credit score can effect many aspects of your life. Credit is fairly new in the sceme of things, and acts something like the old "Company store" You are controled by it and can be punished by not toeing the line.
Be a good citizen,work and don't cross the powers that be, your life is ok,BUT only just ok. Become a paid lacky for the system, and your life can be much better than just ok. Go against the system, and you "might" end up being homeless..I think homeless people are NOT helped mainly because it acts as a very graphic warning to the working class of the powers that be to punish you if you object to the system as it is. Money talks,and BullS*it walks...The system owns you!

[hutch--]

I like that one, an old chinese mate of mine often uses the phrase "cash talks, bullsh*t walks" but  you should not capitulate to it, guile works for you if you get it right.  :P

[dedndave]

the down-side is...
if you play the game, you become part of the problem

for example, here in Phoenix, the housing market is totally upside down
2 out of 3 mortgages are in default
rents are up because people have to live someplace
it doesn't take much thought to see that there is money to be made, here
even if you do not want to buy houses and rent them out,
a person could capitalize on the situation by simply getting into the property management business
these mortgage holders would be happy if they could collect rent on an otherwise empty house
there is money to be made, but it would exacerbate the current economic situation

[Bill Cravener]

Bill,

Cut the war funding and start to tax the rich to pay their share and much of the trouble will be fixed but the real culprit is the Federal Reserve, a private consortium of bankers bleeding America dry and they will not stop until they have bled the last drop of blood out of US taxpayers.

Amen to that Steve. Thomas Jefferson said in 1816: "If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered."

[baltoro]

DAMN !!! This is exciting,... :eek  

Sooner or later someone will have to do something about the global financial crisis and one of the good options is for every debt laden country to default as it would spread the financial load around to the extent that the losers would be the international banks, not individual economies. The end of the Euro would help many troubled European countries as it would allow different economies to handle their own income relative to their own production capacity. It may be time to bring back the Franc, Deutchmark and Drachma and work out some exchange rate betwen them rather than try and force all of these different economies to struggle along on the same currency.

...The complete collapse of Western civilization,...I love it !!!

[dedndave]

when they stop picking up the trash
when the electricity goes out
when water no longer comes out of the faucet
when the police stop going to work every day
when the internet doesn't come up   :eek

it won't be so funny
we may not be too far from having to protect our families and homes with guns

[hutch--]

The nod seems to be that we are seeing GFC(2) in the making. Its not a happy prospect but it may end up having an up side, when everyone gets pissed off enough about foreign bankers, endless dirty scams about money, sleeping in the streets and having an empty stomach then we may see the changes necessary across much of the western world. Europe needs to piss off the Euro, tell Brussells to jump in the lake and take back control of their own economies where market forces establish the exchange rate and Europe will kick off again.

US specifics will see the corporate sectors come back under control of the American people rather than the corporate sector controlling the US to line their pockets. The dominance of foreign banking consortiums pulling the strings of the global economy needs to be broken and the rest of the scams with it. If this ends up seeing some of these greedy bastards go out the door with the arse out of their pants, then well and good, they have been sucking the life out of ordinary people around the world for far too long.

Lasseiz Faire capitalism was based on a free market settled by competition, not dirty back room deals with tame and compliant governments fiddling the rules to suit the corporate sector. The issue will be the threshold that it takes to force the change, hunger is a great driver of change and it has the potential to produce an open free enterprise economy where everyone has equity and can earn an honest living without funding a pile of bludgers and parasites. Funny how a society improves when everyone can contribute and make a buck.  :P

[dedndave]

that would be great, Hutch
i just don't see it happening that way

the wealthy bstrds act as individuals - not as a collective
they all think the same way....
"i am going to keep doing what i have been doing, because it has worked for me"
if they acted as a collective, they would see where things are headed and do just enough to curtail it

[Bill Cravener]

U.S. Loses AAA Credit Rating From Standard & Poor's

[Astro]

I'm not too sad to see this happening. The only thing that matters to these people is money, and when they uncontrollably lose trillions because of their own lack effort in fixing things, then I say "great!".

I know people have a vested interest in the markets not falling due to total mis-management and bad decision-making of the past, but unfortunately it is the only place the bar stewards that created this mess in the first place also get hurt.