Environtment Hazard

[Farabi]

I know, your politician is not as wise as the American citizen, and it is on literal meaning. On indonesia, our gorvment is shit, they did any the company want as long as they gave them money. Freeport is backed up by our govt, and they did killed some of the papua or something people when the did a protest. But the mass media did not care, and I dont know what. You guys need to know that some company like freeport and the others, was destroying their land without anyone notice, and my govt dont care about it. If not you guys who helped them, I dont know who ever will.

Please tell me where I should say about this so there would be many people will listen, thanks.

[xandaz]

   Can't you make it a Facebook event or something? Save Indo from Freeport Petition or something.... Bye Farabi and hope it gets better...
   Best regards
   X

[baltoro]

FARABI,
We had an article in the Los Angeles Times just yesterday about the Greenpeace (Indonesia) demonstration against Rain Forest deforestation in Indonesia.
When you refer to Freeport, are you referring to: PT Freeport Indonesia ???
And, is this corporation a subsidiary of: Freeport-McMoRan Copper and Gold ???
The problem is that the laws of various countries are all different, and, Multi-National corporations are well aware of the undeveloped countries that have poor legal protection and/or they don't enforce the laws that they have.
I did a quick google search for: Indonesia official corruption, and, as you can see google comes up with a long list of articles,...most saying that Indonesia is one of the most corrupt nations in the world.
I get the impression that the problems are well-known, but, that the ruling administration derives most of it's wealth from resource extraction.

[zemtex]

This is the problem of poor countries, if there is no hope, people become corrupt.

:naughty:

[baltoro]

With over 238 million people, Indonesia is the world's fourth most populous country.
Indonesia holds the second largest tract of tropical forests on the planet.

[baltoro]

I found this interesting report: The Politics and Economics of Indonesia's Natural Resources. It's in English. The following is a quote from the report:

"During the 1970s, several major foreign companies became involved in oil extraction. During this period, oil became Indonesia's main export commodity and the country's major source of government revenue. In the 1980s, the role of oil in the Indonesian economy declined while that of other natural resource products, such as liquefied natural gas (LNG), copper, gold and timber, increased. By the mid-1990s, Indonesia had become the world's largest exporter of LNG and hardwood plywood, the second largest producer of tin (after China), the third largest exporter of thermal coal (after Australia and South Africa) and the third largest exporter of copper (after the United States and Chile). It also produced significant quantities of gold, nickel and forest products other than hardwood plywood. During the 1990s, oil and gas contributed approximately 30 per cent of the country's total exports, minerals and related products 19 per cent and forest products 10 per cent."

[Farabi]

FARABI,
We had an article in the Los Angeles Times just yesterday about the Greenpeace (Indonesia) demonstration against Rain Forest deforestation in Indonesia.
When you refer to Freeport, are you referring to: PT Freeport Indonesia ???
And, is this corporation a subsidiary of: Freeport-McMoRan Copper and Gold ???
The problem is that the laws of various countries are all different, and, Multi-National corporations are well aware of the undeveloped countries that have poor legal protection and/or they don't enforce the laws that they have.
I did a quick google search for: Indonesia official corruption, and, as you can see google comes up with a long list of articles,...most saying that Indonesia is one of the most corrupt nations in the world.
I get the impression that the problems are well-known, but, that the ruling administration derives most of it's wealth from resource extraction.

Yeah, very corrupt, and they are all have religion haha. Sorry.
I dont know, I guess it is helpless. I think people already know, I though no one know. Sorry.

[donkey]

Unfortunately the only way to force companies to clean up their act in any country (there are many instances in developed countries as well) is to remove restrictions on liabilities. Under current liability law the investors who drive the mine to reducing costs, in some cases forcing them to cut corners in environmental sustainability are not liable and immune from lawsuits, the company can sidestep many lawsuits by claiming that corporate policy forbade the employees from performing the tasks that caused the problems (even if the policy is sporadically enforced) and the executives are for the most part also immune from lawsuits in LLC's. That leaves only the mining engineer who, if he put his professional stamp on the project, is liable and he certainly won't have the capital necessary to clean up the damage. The solution is to have any and all investors and corporate officers personally liable for any damage they do in both criminal and civil courts. The change would have to be by international treaty and globally enforceable, that is that should a company damage the environment in Indonesia, it can be sued in the US and its global assets are at risk. One thing is for sure, we won't see this happen in our lifetimes.

[MichaelW]

One thing is for sure, we won't see this happen in our lifetimes.

It won't even be seriously considered until it reaches the point that the wealthy cannot insulate themselves from the problems and by then it will be too late to fix the problems.

[baltoro]

I would recommend any of: Michael Klare's books, especially, "Resource Wars: The New Landscape of Global Conflict", 2002,...or, "Blood and Oil: The Dangers and Consequences of America's Growing Dependency on Imported Petroleum", 2004, if you want to get an overview of the international policy issues and military campaigns involved.
It's really depressing stuff,...but, well-researched. :eek

[hutch--]

There is a solution to foreign oil dependence, invade Canada, set up a puppet goverment (Harper) and rape and pillage the Canadian economy to keep SUVs on the road.  :bg

[donkey]

There is a solution to foreign oil dependence, invade Canada, set up a puppet goverment (Harper) and rape and pillage the Canadian economy to keep SUVs on the road.  :bg

Yawn...Been done

[baltoro]

Ya know,...we have a backlog of creative solutions to the world's most serious problems here at the Colosseum,...eager for a reality test drive. :eek
No franchise fees, no pending litigation, no need to tweak the concept,...these babies are READY for some ROAD RAGE,...